From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 1 02:49:42 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 1 Jan 1998 02:49:26 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <001201bd16a3$4d2395e0$2a0000df@Obie> From: "David Shoemaker" To: Subject: Re: Atari Cat boxes Date: Thu, 1 Jan 1998 02:52:04 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: "David Shoemaker" >I will scan the schematic in today and toss it up on my web page. If there >is interest I will also send it to the list. It really doesn't look all >that complex. Ok after spending way too long on my scaner today, and not being done. Anyone have a good idea on the best way to turn these 3+ Meg bmp's into something more reasonable? I am scanning lineart at 600dpi and getting rather huge files. I will finish up the scanning tomorow but I am going to end up with 50+ meg worth of stuff unless I find a beter way to store it. And at 28.8 that will take the better part of forever to post to spies (no way that will fit on my web site). David From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 1 08:33:01 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 1 Jan 1998 08:32:57 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) From: Michael Searle Message-ID: To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Atari Cat boxes References: <001201bd16a3$4d2395e0$2a0000df@Obie> Date: Thu, 01 Jan 1998 16:28:53 GMT X-Mailer: Offlite 0.09 / Termite Internet for Acorn RISC OS Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Michael Searle "David Shoemaker" wrote: >> I will scan the schematic in today and toss it up on my web page. If >> there is interest I will also send it to the list. It really doesn't >> look all that complex. > Ok after spending way too long on my scaner today, and not being done. > Anyone have a good idea on the best way to turn these 3+ Meg bmp's into > something more reasonable? > I am scanning lineart at 600dpi and getting rather huge files. > I will finish up the scanning tomorow but I am going to end up with 50+ > meg worth of stuff unless I find a beter way to store it. For a 2 colour image like that, GIF will probably compress them very well. (there are better ways but everyone can read gifs.) -- Michael Searle - csubl@csv.warwick.ac.uk From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 1 11:37:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 1 Jan 1998 11:36:36 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 1 Jan 1998 11:36:33 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Atari Cat boxes Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) they should compress down a bit at 1 bit per pixel and TIFF encoding with CCITT level 4 compression From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 1 13:15:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 1 Jan 1998 13:15:10 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <34AC06AD.22DF > Date: Thu, 01 Jan 1998 14:12:13 -0700 From: Jess Askey Organization: The Audio Analyst/The Game Spot X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Atari Cat boxes References: <001201bd16a3$4d2395e0$2a0000df@Obie> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Jess Askey David Shoemaker wrote: > > >I will scan the schematic in today and toss it up on my web page. If there > >is interest I will also send it to the list. It really doesn't look all > >that complex. > > Ok after spending way too long on my scaner today, and not being done. > Anyone have a good idea on the best way to turn these 3+ Meg bmp's into > something more reasonable? > > I am scanning lineart at 600dpi and getting rather huge files. > > I will finish up the scanning tomorow but I am going to end up with 50+ meg > worth of stuff unless I find a beter way to store it. > > And at 28.8 that will take the better part of forever to post to spies (no > way that will fit on my web site). > > David I scan schems in at 150-200 dpi in greyscale. If you have a nice image editor you can adjust the gamma and get them looking pretty nice. Also since they aren't b/w you get better edges on the lines. I haveen't had good luck with lineart scans unless they are extremely high res. I ususally save in .jpg format but Im not sure how that works for everyone. .jpg's compress down nicely while maintaining 24 bit color resoulution. .gif's dont compress as much but since they are only 256 color (which is still fine for schems) they are inherently smaller datawise, but a good .jpg can be smaller still. jess -- Jess M. Askey *** Coming Soon - The Game Archive *** Game Spot/Audio Analyst * Pinball, Video, Parts, Collecting * 509 S. 2nd Street Unit B * http://www.gamearchive.com * Laramie WY 82070 ************************************** From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 1 21:37:47 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 1 Jan 1998 21:37:09 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <003101bd1740$d7d13600$2a0000df@Obie> From: "David Shoemaker" To: Subject: Re: Atari Cat boxes Date: Thu, 1 Jan 1998 21:39:41 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: "David Shoemaker" Ok I have finished scanning and I have them as .gif files. Pretty good reduction, 3.5 Meg total for all the pages. I am going to FTP to ftp.spies.com as I don't have quite enough room on my web page quota. I will be able to answer questions on the schematic as needed. I will also work on scanning and or OCRing the rest of the manual in over the next couple of weeks as needed. David From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 1 23:18:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 1 Jan 1998 23:18:17 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 1 Jan 1998 23:18:13 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: catbox schematics up Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) ftp://www.spies.com/arcade/schematics/atari/catbox I'll wire up the web pages, and create a .pdf file tomorrow.. From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Sat Jan 3 17:16:32 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Sat, 3 Jan 1998 17:15:47 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) From: zonn (Zonn) To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Atari Cat boxes Date: Sun, 04 Jan 1998 01:17:17 GMT Message-ID: <34afe26c.92288492 > References: <001201bd16a3$4d2395e0$2a0000df@Obie> In-Reply-To: <001201bd16a3$4d2395e0$2a0000df@Obie> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: zonn (Zonn) On Thu, 1 Jan 1998 02:52:04 -0800, "David Shoemaker" = wrote: >>I will scan the schematic in today and toss it up on my web page. If = there >>is interest I will also send it to the list. It really doesn't look = all >>that complex. > >Ok after spending way too long on my scaner today, and not being done. >Anyone have a good idea on the best way to turn these 3+ Meg bmp's into >something more reasonable? I've always found the best way to save B&W images without muddying up the= edges (like JPEG does) is to save the files as an uncompressed .BMP and use = PKZIP with the "-ex" switch (for maximum compression). So far that always seems to = beat any other lossless method. -Zonn <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ------ ___ Member of A.A.C.S.: |---- | ( ) Association for Artistically / / ( () ) Challenged Signatures / / //\\ // (__) / ---/ // \\ //\\ // zonn -------| // \\/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Jan 5 12:18:45 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 5 Jan 1998 12:16:56 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-CriticalPath-Sent: 5 Jan 1998 20:15:14 GMT Message-ID: <34B13DFE.1021@netconx.net> Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 14:09:34 -0600 From: Todd Miller X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist Subject: Star Trek pinout wanted Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Todd Miller I just picked up a Star Trek cage w/boards. I have it hooked up on the bench to a scope & it appears to be working. If any one has the cpu board pinout for the front (control panel & etc ) I'd like to walk it through the self test. It's not the same as my Space Fury & I didn't see it on spies either. I tried the TIFF files, but my software displays them skewed & unreadable. -- Thanks Todd http://www.netconx.net/~litterbox From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Jan 5 12:25:48 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 5 Jan 1998 12:24:51 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 12:24:47 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Star Trek pinout wanted Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) you're going to need the spinner adapter board too.. clay, do you have any left? From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Jan 5 13:50:10 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 5 Jan 1998 13:48:40 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 13:49:59 -0800 To: vectorlist From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Sega Multigame update... Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Clay Cowgill Hi everybody, Hope you all had enjoyable holidays... Anyway, just a little update. I couldn't leave well enough alone and ended up making a couple more software modifications to the Multigame and then wrote a "real" installation manual (with pictures and whatnot like the ESB manual). So, now that that's out of the way, I'll be shipping out the multigame kits in small batches over the next couple weeks. I'll put the manual up on my webpage in PDF form later today. (A little hectic here today-- trying to remember what my job is... ;-) -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Jan 5 14:00:55 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 5 Jan 1998 13:59:50 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 21:59:27 GMT X-Sender: jeffh (Unverified) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: vectorlist From: jeffh (Jeff Hendrix) Subject: EPROMs Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: jeffh (Jeff Hendrix) Hey Guys, I just bought a bunch of EPROMs, and I don't need all of them (it was an "all or nothing" deal) and I would like to pass on the savings to my fellow collectors. All have been erased and I'll guarantee against DOA. Shipping will be $3 for any size order. I have the following sizes 27c128 $1.25 27c256 $1.50 27c512 $2.00 27c010 $2.50 D8748H $3.00 (this one is a micro controller) I will also consider trades for RGVAC stuff (mostly looking for xy stuff) -jeff jeffh Buy/Sell/Trade classic video arcade games. www.diac.com/~jeffh/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Jan 5 15:51:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 5 Jan 1998 15:48:47 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <34B17111.D782517E@istar.ca> Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 15:47:29 -0800 From: John Robertson Organization: John's Jukes Ltd. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Star Trek pinout wanted References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: John Robertson You can use ANY spinner on this game, I have used clone arkanoid spinners with great success... John :-#)# Al Kossow wrote: > > you're going to need the spinner adapter board too.. > > clay, do you have any left? -- John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) mailto:jrr "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out." From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Jan 5 15:54:02 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 5 Jan 1998 15:53:00 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 15:52:56 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Star Trek pinout wanted Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) "You can use ANY spinner on this game, I have used clone arkanoid spinners with great success... John :-#)#" there is a small PCB between the spinner and the CPU board too, which is what I meant. the schematic for it is on www.spies.com, and clay was building a few boards up in the batch of multigame boards. From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Jan 5 16:52:47 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 5 Jan 1998 16:51:15 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <3FF8121C9B6DD111812100805F31FC0D1CDB49 > From: "David Shoemaker (RhoTech)" To: "'vectorlist > Cc: David Shoemaker Subject: RE: Battle Zone board problems Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 16:50:31 -0800 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: "David Shoemaker (RhoTech)" What is the expected Peak to Peak on the X and Y outs from an Atari vector game? During my testing I am using my scope to check for signal at the test points but I am seeing very small (like .2v ptp) signals. Seems a bit low but I don't know what it should be. Now if I could just get my Tektronix scope with X / Y mode fixed I could actually see what the vectors were putting out. My Tenma scope doesn't have x/y. :( Thanks, David > ---------- > From: David Shoemaker[SMTP:davids ] > Reply To: vectorlist > Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 1997 9:06 PM > To: Vectorlist > Cc: David Shoemaker > Subject: Battle Zone board problems > > I have two BZ AVG boards each with different problems, I am hoping that > one of you here can give me some help.  As I have no working BZ set I am > shooting somewhat in the dark. >   > Monitor checked out and working, checked with an Asteroids. >   > AVG #1 > No vector output (flat line 0 v on X / Y out) (SK on) > Watchdog barking > With WD disabled still nothing. > Test switch results in nothing >   > AVG #2 > No Vectors (Spot killer on) > Board runs > Self test results in "Long" tones continuously.  I have waited 15 before > giving up. > This board is eating the TL082 at D10 (Y).  I replace it and it appears to > work ok for a minute or two then the output goes to +15Vdc.  And that is > the end of that op amp. Inputs appear ok. > At some point in the past the board was hit pretty hard by something, the > X op amp had blown (literally).  This has been replaced and appears to be > ok. >   > I have 4 math box boards but at this time can't tell what is what with > them. >   > As an aside as I was doing this mail I hooked up my third AVG board and > noticed that it had a different ROM revision and very faded the words Red > Baron on it. That would explain why it was not working quite right.  I > will have to test it at some other point. >   > Thanks, > David > From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Jan 5 17:15:05 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 5 Jan 1998 17:13:54 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-CriticalPath-Sent: 6 Jan 1998 01:11:59 GMT Message-ID: <34B1838B.CBA@netconx.net> Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 19:06:19 -0600 From: Todd Miller X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Star Trek pinout wanted References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Todd Miller Al Kossow wrote: > > there is a small PCB between the spinner and the CPU board too, > which is what I meant. Yep, ordered them w/ Sega multi game kit last month. Is that why there is an edge card conn on the front of the cage instead of a harness ?? > the schematic for it is on www.spies.com, and clay was building > a few boards up in the batch of multigame boards. I tried a different software package at work to view the TIFF's, still unreadable when I zoom in. Can they be converted to JPG's or PDF's ? -- Thanks Todd http://www.netconx.net/~litterbox From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Jan 5 17:33:43 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 5 Jan 1998 17:32:27 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 17:32:21 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Star Trek pinout wanted Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) "I tried a different software package at work to view the TIFF's, still unreadable when I zoom in. Can they be converted to JPG's or PDF's ?" ..guess it's time for me to do that i'll convert the wiring harnesses to pdf's tonight "Is that why there is an edge card conn on the front of the cage instead of a harness ??" no, there was a small circuit board that was placed near the control panel that was a quadrature decoder which ran from the front of the game back to the card cage. I guess the connector on the top of the card box was there for EMI/RFI shielding. I'll send out a mail message as soon as the TIFFs are converted to a PDF file From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Jan 5 18:02:31 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 5 Jan 1998 18:01:03 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 18:02:06 -0800 To: vectorlist From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: Star Trek pinout wanted Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Clay Cowgill >"You can use ANY spinner on this game, I have used clone arkanoid >spinners with great success... >John :-#)#" > >there is a small PCB between the spinner and the CPU board too, >which is what I meant. > >the schematic for it is on www.spies.com, and clay was building >a few boards up in the batch of multigame boards. I think about 4 or so of the spinner boards were spoken for. That would leave me with 1 or 2 left. Most any quadrature-output type "spinner" should work. I haven't tried it with anything other than the Sega spinner yet. I have some all-in-onw TTL output guys to try, a TRON spinner, and a couple of old Tektronix "thumbwheel" spinners too... -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Jan 5 18:39:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 5 Jan 1998 18:37:50 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 18:37:45 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: G80 schematics in pdf format Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) I left the drawings as 8 1/2 * 11, but made them into a single pdf file. http://www.spies.com/arcade/schematics/convertaGame/G80.pdf the individual sheets are still up there too. From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Jan 6 07:39:38 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 07:37:56 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Comments: ( Received on motgate.mot.com from client pobox.mot.com, sender jenison ) Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 09:35:00 -0600 (CST) From: Mark Jenison Message-Id: <9801060934.ZM9025@calcite> In-Reply-To: Todd Miller "Re: Star Trek pinout wanted" (Jan 5, 7:06pm) References: <199801060120.UAA04535 > X-face: "@9[FFAftX<9}2=gaPlIyRv_K%h[>.@"8t}B2So!iv.\#M9NplA9bDudBQ|]E`WL9Kd,Tn2v.0OGcE<$yg{&}(m:mB\GO9L+yE}6=d17BM X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.1 10apr95) To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Star Trek pinout wanted Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Mark Jenison On Jan 5, 7:06pm, Todd Miller wrote: > Subject: Re: Star Trek pinout wanted > Al Kossow wrote: > > > > there is a small PCB between the spinner and the CPU board too, > > which is what I meant. > > Yep, ordered them w/ Sega multi game kit last month. > Is that why there is an edge card conn on the front of the > cage instead of a harness ?? The edge card conn in the card cage means you have a Star Trek Kit cage. I've never had an entire kit, but one can theorize that the kit contained a 22 pin generic wiring harness, and a finger board was inserted between the two (instead of the kit containing a harness with about 6 miscellanous mate-n-lock connectors like the real converta-cabinet has). Star Trek was a popular Asteroids conversion. Replace the vector monitor and insert a finger board and re-wire the control panel, and most of the existing Asteroids harness could be re-used. However, the edge card conn you mention doesn't have a pin out that matches any game (as far as I can tell), so a mapping finger board was probably required for any or all Star Trek conversion kits. This is all just my theory, of course :-). Anyone ever had a complete Star Trek conversion kit? I have the manual, but it never mentions any particular conversion procedures. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Mark Jenison E-mail address: jenison Cellular Infrastructure Group Motorola--Arlington Heights, IL ---------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Mark Jenison From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Jan 6 07:49:12 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 07:48:02 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 07:47:59 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Star Trek pinout wanted Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) "This is all just my theory, of course :-). Anyone ever had a complete Star Trek conversion kit? I have the manual, but it never mentions any particular conversion procedures." This is correct. I converted a Star Trek BACK to an Asteroids a few months ago and there is a finger board on the top of the card cage. From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Jan 6 07:59:03 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 07:57:58 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980106095954.00997700 > X-Sender: mmatelsk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 09:59:55 -0600 To: vectorlist From: Mit_Matelske (Mit Matelske) Subject: Re: Star Trek pinout wanted Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Mit_Matelske (Mit Matelske) > >Star Trek was a popular Asteroids conversion. Replace the vector monitor and >insert a finger board and re-wire the control panel, and most of the existing >Asteroids harness could be re-used. However, the edge card conn you mention >doesn't have a pin out that matches any game (as far as I can tell), so a >mapping finger board was probably required for any or all Star Trek conversion >kits. > >This is all just my theory, of course :-). Anyone ever had a complete Star >Trek conversion kit? I have the manual, but it never mentions any particular >conversion procedures. > >---------------------------------------------------------------------- >Mark Jenison E-mail address: jenison >Cellular Infrastructure Group Motorola--Arlington Heights, IL >---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > >-- >Mark Jenison > I have the wiring harness and cage for a Star Trek that was out of an Asteroids Deluxe. If I remember I'll check it out tonight ... I do remember the soldering job on the fingerboard being pretty damn sloppy :) Mit From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Jan 6 09:32:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 09:31:01 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 09:32:26 -0800 To: vectorlist From: Clay Cowgill Subject: RE: Battle Zone board problems Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Clay Cowgill >What is the expected Peak to Peak on the X and Y outs from an Atari vector >game? During my testing I am using my scope to check for signal at the test >points but I am seeing very small (like .2v ptp) signals. Seems a bit low >but I don't know what it should be. If you're looking at the test points on the output stages of the AVG, you should be seeing something more around 10-14V peak to peak. -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Jan 6 09:54:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 09:53:08 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 09:53:04 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Mint Zektor found! Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) If you haven't seen Lee Bender's posting already, take a look in RGVAC. The shots are up on http://www.spies.com/arcade/photos/index5.html From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Jan 6 10:36:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 10:35:06 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 10:34:54 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Zektor posting from RGVAC Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) From: Lee Bender Subject: NEW Zektor Found! and other surprises!!! Lines: 32 Last week, while on vacation, I did my usual snooping around in wharehouses and found what has to be the Holy Grail of arcade video games: A 100% complete dedicated Zektor that has been in storage since new! I know this sounds unbelieveable, so I have uploaded pictures of it so you can see how nice it truly is. The game was put on location for just a few weeks when it was new (I saw the records) and took in about $150 before being pulled (probably a monitor problem). Everything is here and original and complete. Please look at the following pictures and ENJOY! Other Noteworthy finds: A BRAND NEW (Never put on location) Scramble Cocktail. No kidding. It still had the warranty card in the coin door and the purchase slip was taped to the glass (I still have it) It was in 100% absolutley MINT condition but it has experienced a little cracking on the backglass in a small area as a result of cleaning it. A fabulous find anyway! See my pic that I have posted of this one also. A FROGGER cocktail (19" monitor) I haven't seen one of these before. Works great. A MINI Phoenix. Missing 13" monitor, but other wise complete. If someone is interested in purchasing any of this equipment, I may entertain offers. :) Lee From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Jan 6 11:36:39 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 11:35:18 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 11:36:25 -0800 To: vectorlist From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Sega Multigame Poll... Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Clay Cowgill Hi Guys. I'm trying to decide how many PCB's I need to order for the "main run" of Sega Multigame Kits. My little post-it pad says that I had interest in about 22 boards (paid orders) from Vectorlist. I've got checks in for 11 of those. So, I just need to know: ***** If you told me earlier that you'd like a Sega Multigame Kit, but have NOT sent me a check yet, please let me know that you still want a board (or not). I don't need the money right away, but I do need a firm commitment that you'll send it someday. :-) (Like in the next 3 months.) ***** From the response on this over the next few days I'll order the main run of boards. Early orders will start shipping in the next day or two. -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Jan 6 13:53:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 13:51:03 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <34B27FDE.56C5@worldnet.att.net> Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 13:02:54 -0600 From: RWood54741@worldnet.att.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-WorldNet (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Star Trek pinout wanted References: <34B13DFE.1021@netconx.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: RWood54741@worldnet.att.net Todd Miller wrote: > > I just picked up a Star Trek cage w/boards. I have it hooked up > on the bench to a scope & it appears to be working. Todd, Glad that Star Trek boardset is working. That proves that when "Honest" Bob Wood sells something as "untested" then it really is untested. Honest Bob From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Jan 6 13:57:33 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 13:56:01 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <199801062156.QAA13795@mail.atl.bellsouth.net> From: "The Retrodaddy" To: Subject: Re: Sega Multigame Poll... Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 16:53:26 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: "The Retrodaddy" I have not sent you the moneyn yet, and did not know that you wanted me too. :> I DEFINITELY want one. I picked up a Start Trek just for this thing. Unless you need the money right away, just put me down as a definite, and let me know when you have a stack ready. Actually, if it is not a problem. put me down for 2 of them. Michael Benge ---------- > From: Clay Cowgill > To: vectorlist > Cc: Clay Cowgill > Subject: Sega Multigame Poll... > Date: Tuesday, January 06, 1998 2:36 PM > > Hi Guys. > > I'm trying to decide how many PCB's I need to order for the "main run" of > Sega Multigame Kits. > > My little post-it pad says that I had interest in about 22 boards (paid > orders) from Vectorlist. I've got checks in for 11 of those. So, I just > need to know: > > ***** If you told me earlier that you'd like a Sega Multigame Kit, but have > NOT sent me a check yet, please let me know that you still want a board (or > not). I don't need the money right away, but I do need a firm commitment > that you'll send it someday. :-) (Like in the next 3 months.) ***** > > From the response on this over the next few days I'll order the main run of > boards. Early orders will start shipping in the next day or two. > > -Clay > > Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager > _______________________________________________________________________ > /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay > \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ > > From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Jan 6 14:23:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 14:21:41 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <199801062221.RAA00185@mail.atl.bellsouth.net> From: "The Retrodaddy" To: Subject: Re: Sega Multigame Poll... Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 17:19:54 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: "The Retrodaddy" doh!!!! :> > I have not sent you the moneyn yet, and did not know that you wanted me > > I'm trying to decide how many PCB's I need to order for the "main run" of > > Sega Multigame Kits. From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Jan 6 15:24:41 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 15:23:06 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 15:24:08 -0800 To: vectorlist From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: Sega Multigame Poll... Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Clay Cowgill >I have not sent you the moneyn yet, and did not know that you wanted me >too. :> I DEFINITELY want one. I picked up a Start Trek just for this >thing. Unless you need the money right away, just put me down as a >definite, and let me know when you have a stack ready. Actually, if it is >not a problem. put me down for 2 of them. Yeah, it wasn't a "have to send money" message a while back, just a "send it when you're ready". :-) I just want to be sure I have enough to go around. I'll put you down for two for now. If you change your mind later one more or less won't be a big deal... -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Jan 6 17:00:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 16:58:31 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 19:00:27 -0500 To: vectorlist From: Woodcock@123net.net (Gregg Woodcock) Subject: Re: Sega Multigame Poll... Cc: Clay Cowgill Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Woodcock@123net.net (Gregg Woodcock) At 11:36 1/6/98, Clay Cowgill wrote: >Hi Guys. > >I'm trying to decide how many PCB's I need to order for the "main run" of >Sega Multigame Kits. > >My little post-it pad says that I had interest in about 22 boards (paid >orders) from Vectorlist. I've got checks in for 11 of those. So, I just >need to know: > >***** If you told me earlier that you'd like a Sega Multigame Kit, but have >NOT sent me a check yet, please let me know that you still want a board (or >not). I don't need the money right away, but I do need a firm commitment >that you'll send it someday. :-) (Like in the next 3 months.) ***** > > From the response on this over the next few days I'll order the main run of >boards. Early orders will start shipping in the next day or two. Clay, I am still in for 2 complete sets (i.e. 2 multis + 2 spinners) and also 2 of the "new" ESB kits. I will send the $$ (and some SW PCBs) in the next week or so. I just printed out the order form! Can I get some kind of bulk discount? :> From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Jan 6 23:12:33 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 23:10:25 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <34B32A18.400B0460@istar.ca> Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 23:09:12 -0800 From: John Robertson Organization: John's Jukes Ltd. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "vectorlist > Subject: Simple XY B&W system Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: John Robertson Now that I have your attention, I have stuck on my web site a 600K JPEG file named http://www.flippers.com/hoei-xy.jpg which is my promised (a few months ago) scan of an old Asteroids clone's solution for the deflection circuitry problems. They used off-the-shelf audio amp modules! After all that is well within the bandwidth for these games... Would someone PLASE put this up on Spies and post a note so I can direct enquiries,( I don't want to e-mail it to the group-Duh!- but neither do I know the process to do this...)My site is only on a 128K link to the net, so it's a little SLOW for more than a few folks at any one time... John :-#)# -- John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) mailto:jrr "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out." From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Jan 6 23:22:47 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 23:21:15 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 23:21:11 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Simple XY B&W system Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) http://www.flippers.com/hoei-xy.jpg wasn't found From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 00:49:10 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 00:46:54 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <34B3409D.CC5A9452@istar.ca> Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 00:45:17 -0800 From: John Robertson Organization: John's Jukes Ltd. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Simple XY B&W system References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: John Robertson Yeah, opps, my ftp program crashed, so it might be a day or two untill I find where the problem is. I really hate DOS/WINDOWS!!! John :-#(# Al Kossow wrote: > > http://www.flippers.com/hoei-xy.jpg wasn't found -- John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) mailto:jrr "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out." From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 07:28:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 07:26:28 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-CriticalPath-Sent: 7 Jan 1998 15:24:25 GMT Message-ID: <34B39EA6.20EC@netconx.net> Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 09:26:30 -0600 From: Todd Miller X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist Subject: WTB:SPO-250 IC Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Todd Miller I thought I'd ask since a mint Zektor surfaced, does anyone have a extra SPO-250 Orator chip to sell ? The one in the Star Trek set I just picked up is dead. -- Thanks Todd http://www.netconx.net/~litterbox From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 11:55:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 11:54:29 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19980107135339.00c8fb64@netins.net> X-Sender: omar@netins.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 13:53:39 -0600 To: vectorlist From: omar@netins.net Subject: More Star Trek questions In-Reply-To: <34B13DFE.1021@netconx.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: omar@netins.net Like Todd, I too just acquired a Star Trek cage with boards. Not having the original power supply, I'm wondering if there is any reason I can't use a standard PC supply to power this thing? Or is that what is commonly done already? What is pin 3 on the power connecter? Is this some sort of power up reset or power good signal? Can I just tie it high? Thanks, Mike Benedict From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 11:59:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 11:57:53 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 11:57:50 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Re: More Star Trek questions Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) A PC supply will work fine. Pin 3 is a power good signal that I tie to 12v through a resistor. I guess other people have used the power ok siginal of the PC supply itself. From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 12:05:42 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 12:04:07 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 12:04:02 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Re: More Star Trek questions Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) I double-checked with the analog guy in the cube next to me, and any voltage greater than .7 of a volt or so will turn Q6 on, so connecting it to the power ok (assuming it's active high..) out of the PC power supply is the right thing to do.. From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 12:25:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 12:23:50 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-CriticalPath-Sent: 7 Jan 1998 20:22:10 GMT Message-ID: <34B3E29F.4A9D@netconx.net> Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 14:16:31 -0600 From: Todd Miller X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist Subject: Re: More Star Trek questions References: <3.0.3.32.19980107135339.00c8fb64@netins.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Todd Miller omar@netins.net wrote: > > > What is pin 3 on the power connecter? Is this some sort of power up reset > or power good signal? Can I just tie it high? I use a PC supply on my bench set up, the pin 3 is an AC signal for the power up reset. I used the 'power good' of the supply or you could tie it to 5v as well -- Todd From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 12:30:29 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 12:28:59 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 12:28:54 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Clay's power supply adapter Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) hey clay, when you lay out the board for the PC adapter could you pin out some output pads so you can just plug it into the side of a G80 card cage? or is there another 'favorite' pinout that could be brought out as well? From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 13:23:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 13:21:28 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 13:22:34 -0800 To: vectorlist From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: More Star Trek questions Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Clay Cowgill >What is pin 3 on the power connecter? Is this some sort of power up reset >or power good signal? Can I just tie it high? I actually just tack a little wire from the base-side of the resistor on Q6 to +5 on the CPU board... -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 14:45:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 14:43:02 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <34B3FDD6.255F > Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 15:12:38 -0700 From: Jess Askey Organization: The Audio Analyst/The Game Spot X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Vectorlist Subject: Atari AVG Controller Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Jess Askey I know this idea has been tossed around before but the AVG chip has once again stuck it's ugly head into my life, twice this time. The last 4 vector boards that I have repaired had bad AVG controllers on them at that was all, im running desperately low and really dont' want to cannabalize other games anymore, it's dreadful. Like I need another project... not. But I need some guidance at least from all you PAL/PIC/GAL people. Since this IC has ram in it, is that the part that is throwing the wrench into putting this onto a basic PAL? What programable IC's would this circuit fit onto? It is such a simple circuit, can it be that hard? I would be interested in getting at least 20-25 of them if I could be done somehow. Any ideas? jess -- Jess M. Askey *** Coming Soon - The Game Archive *** Game Spot/Audio Analyst * Pinball, Video, Parts, Collecting * 509 S. 2nd Street Unit B * http://www.gamearchive.com * Laramie WY 82070 ************************************** From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 15:04:20 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 15:02:55 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19980107163609.00c9cc38@netins.net> X-Sender: omar@netins.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 16:36:09 -0600 To: vectorlist From: omar@netins.net Subject: Re: More Star Trek questions In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: omar@netins.net At 12:04 PM 1/7/98 -0800, you wrote: >I double-checked with the analog guy in the cube next to me, and any voltage >greater than .7 of a volt or so will turn Q6 on, so connecting it to the >power ok (assuming it's active high..) out of the PC power supply is the >right thing to do.. Great! I have a bunch of good power supplies that were pulled from old 286, 386 computers. I'll be glad to finally put at least one of them to use. Any suggestions on what I should do for a monitor? I mean should I look for a G-08 monitor to use, or should I avoid those like the plague and use something else? Thanks for all the responses! Mike Benedict From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 15:08:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 15:07:11 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 17:06:19 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: Vectorlist Subject: Re: Atari AVG Controller In-Reply-To: <34B3FDD6.255F > Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: On Wed, 7 Jan 1998, Jess Askey wrote: > Like I need another project... not. But I need some guidance at least > from all you PAL/PIC/GAL people. Since this IC has ram in it, is that > the part that is throwing the wrench into putting this onto a basic PAL? > What programable IC's would this circuit fit onto? It is such a simple > circuit, can it be that hard? I would be interested in getting at least > 20-25 of them if I could be done somehow. > Any ideas? > jess Yeah, PAL's can't really do RAM. The only "standard cell" way to do a RAM is with a flip-flop/latch, and most PLDs have very limited numbers of those (i.e. not in the 1000s of flip-flops/latches that are needed for a simple 2k x 8 6116 RAM, for example) How much RAM is there?....maybe a larger FPGA might work? Joe From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 15:15:04 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 15:13:31 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 15:13:26 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Re: More Star Trek questions Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) "Any suggestions on what I should do for a monitor?" unfortunately, you don't have any choice. the G08 is the only vector monitor fast enough From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 15:16:41 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 15:15:19 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 15:15:13 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: AVG chip schematics Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) didn't someone say that they had the schematics for this part? clay? From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 16:07:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 16:05:27 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <34B41762.419A > Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 17:01:38 -0700 From: Jess Askey Organization: The Audio Analyst/The Game Spot X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist Subject: Re: AVG chip schematics References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Jess Askey Al Kossow wrote: > > didn't someone say that they had the schematics for this > part? clay? I have them. I made a page at... http://www.gamearchive.com/video/manufacturer/atari/vector/tech/avg_controller/ Whew, that is a mouthful. :-) As it says there, the RAM is only 12 bits at 4 words. Pretty small. jess -- Jess M. Askey *** Coming Soon - The Game Archive *** Game Spot/Audio Analyst * Pinball, Video, Parts, Collecting * 509 S. 2nd Street Unit B * http://www.gamearchive.com * Laramie WY 82070 ************************************** From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 16:31:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 16:29:34 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 16:30:33 -0800 To: vectorlist From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: Atari AVG Controller Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Clay Cowgill > Like I need another project... not. But I need some guidance at least > from all you PAL/PIC/GAL people. Since this IC has ram in it, is that >the part that is throwing the wrench into putting this onto a basic PAL? >What programable IC's would this circuit fit onto? It is such a simple >circuit, can it be that hard? I would be interested in getting at least >20-25 of them if I could be done somehow. I went down this path once before. I have the entire thing designed out in TTL, and placed and routed on a PCB. Even have parts to build 10 or 20. The only gotcha was that the PCB is kinda large to accomodate all the 'LS type chips. My original poll was looking for who was interested and would you want to pay $20-25 bucks a pop for them. (The PCB's in low quantity were around $12-15 each, so if you add in $3-5 worth of chips and some $$$ for time/assembly they were in the $20-25 range.) The consensus seemed to be that $30 Space Duel boards were relatively easy to find and except for a couple people nobody was interested so I didn't make any. That having been said... Are enough people interested that I could do a run of 40-50 boards? That should be enough to keep the price at or under $20 I'd think... (Since it then makes sense to buy chips in quantity 100+ which helps costs and the number of boards keeps the setup fees down.) I looked at the CPLD/FPGA angle too. The circuit isn't really complex (it's really just 133% of the discrete stuff you see on Tempest to do the Vector Address Generator), but it has some wide counters and 12bit wide registers (I think four deep) for a stack. The twist was: Plan A: CPLD only. Maybe do-able with big enough CPLD. Cost wasn't too bad-- around $10 for the part, but the bigger CPLD's won't fit inside the footprint of a 40 pin dip so the PCB cost still added another $5-7. Have to implement design in Synario or some HDL, or Viewlogic. Kinda involved. Plan B: CPLD + register file chips. ('670s) Cheaper CPLD (for counters, muxes, and logic) for around $6, register files added maybe $1, now you need a bigger board to hold the extra chips and I/O's might be a problem on the CPLD's. Same complications as Plan A for designing the thing. Plan C: FPGA. Needs an external boot memory, dev. tools not handy, needs big PCB because of footprint size, pain in the rear to hand solder. I didn't want to deal with it. (singles pricing for the cheapest Xilinx part plus a serial configuration memory is about $18 from Digikey-- and I'm not sure the design would fit in that part either.) Plan D: TTL on a big PCB. Easy to implement. Big PCB adds cost, chips are relatively cheap though. For just cranking something out that'll work I liked Plan D. For a cool project I liked Plan A. But, I have enough cool projects so I didn't want to take on Plan A. The FPGA route might be good if you could get a high-enough density FGPA for the Xilinx 4000 series quantity pricing -- around $3 per chip plus about $.75 for the serial memory. -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 16:39:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 16:37:34 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 16:38:37 -0800 To: vectorlist From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: AVG chip schematics Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Clay Cowgill >As it says there, the RAM is only 12 bits at 4 words. Pretty small. > jess Yeah, but that's 48 macrocells in most CPLD's. Figure one macrocell for each bit in a counter (14 more) and some more stuff that isn't in the Tempest AVG schematic and you're over a 64 macrocell CPLD and into a 128. The 128 cell CPLD could still be pretty cost-effective though... Damn it. Now you've got me interested in the problem again. ;-) -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 17:07:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 17:05:35 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <34B42562.3BFB > Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 18:01:22 -0700 From: Jess Askey Organization: The Audio Analyst/The Game Spot X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist Subject: Re: AVG chip schematics References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Jess Askey Clay Cowgill wrote: > > >As it says there, the RAM is only 12 bits at 4 words. Pretty small. > > jess > > Yeah, but that's 48 macrocells in most CPLD's. Figure one macrocell for > each bit in a counter (14 more) and some more stuff that isn't in the > Tempest AVG schematic Is there more to it than what is shown in the tempest schem? Did you and Travis find some kind of official schem for it? I would be more than happy to help in donating manpower for Plan A, but since Im self employed, my resources are very limited. My nicest test equipment would be either the HP-5004 or the Fluke Scopemeter. :-0 jess -- Jess M. Askey *** Coming Soon - The Game Archive *** Game Spot/Audio Analyst * Pinball, Video, Parts, Collecting * 509 S. 2nd Street Unit B * http://www.gamearchive.com * Laramie WY 82070 ************************************** From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 17:07:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 17:05:42 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <34B4257B.3B7 > Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 18:01:47 -0700 From: Jess Askey Organization: The Audio Analyst/The Game Spot X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Atari AVG Controller References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Jess Askey Clay Cowgill wrote: > > > Like I need another project... not. But I need some guidance at least > > from all you PAL/PIC/GAL people. Since this IC has ram in it, is that > >the part that is throwing the wrench into putting this onto a basic PAL? > >What programable IC's would this circuit fit onto? It is such a simple > >circuit, can it be that hard? I would be interested in getting at least > >20-25 of them if I could be done somehow. > > I went down this path once before. I have the entire thing designed out in > TTL, and placed and routed on a PCB. Even have parts to build 10 or 20. > The only gotcha was that the PCB is kinda large to accomodate all the 'LS > type chips. > > My original poll was looking for who was interested and would you want to > pay $20-25 bucks a pop for them. (The PCB's in low quantity were around > $12-15 each, so if you add in $3-5 worth of chips and some $$$ for > time/assembly they were in the $20-25 range.) > > The consensus seemed to be that $30 Space Duel boards were relatively easy > to find and except for a couple people nobody was interested so I didn't > make any. > > That having been said... > > Are enough people interested that I could do a run of 40-50 boards? That > should be enough to keep the price at or under $20 I'd think... (Since it > then makes sense to buy chips in quantity 100+ which helps costs and the > number of boards keeps the setup fees down.) > > I looked at the CPLD/FPGA angle too. The circuit isn't really complex > (it's really just 133% of the discrete stuff you see on Tempest to do the > Vector Address Generator), but it has some wide counters and 12bit wide > registers (I think four deep) for a stack. The twist was: > > Plan A: CPLD only. Maybe do-able with big enough CPLD. Cost wasn't too > bad-- around $10 for the part, but the bigger CPLD's won't fit inside the > footprint of a 40 pin dip so the PCB cost still added another $5-7. Have > to implement design in Synario or some HDL, or Viewlogic. Kinda involved. > > Plan B: CPLD + register file chips. ('670s) Cheaper CPLD (for counters, > muxes, and logic) for around $6, register files added maybe $1, now you > need a bigger board to hold the extra chips and I/O's might be a problem on > the CPLD's. Same complications as Plan A for designing the thing. > > Plan C: FPGA. Needs an external boot memory, dev. tools not handy, needs > big PCB because of footprint size, pain in the rear to hand solder. I > didn't want to deal with it. (singles pricing for the cheapest Xilinx part > plus a serial configuration memory is about $18 from Digikey-- and I'm not > sure the design would fit in that part either.) > > Plan D: TTL on a big PCB. Easy to implement. Big PCB adds cost, chips > are relatively cheap though. > > For just cranking something out that'll work I liked Plan D. For a cool > project I liked Plan A. But, I have enough cool projects so I didn't want > to take on Plan A. The FPGA route might be good if you could get a > high-enough density FGPA for the Xilinx 4000 series quantity pricing -- > around $3 per chip plus about $.75 for the serial memory. Thank you much for the very detailed explanation. That is exactly what I was looking for. Thank you again for spending so much time looking into this. What dimensions does your current PCB require? Even at $20-25 each I would be interested in buying about 10 of them right now (Im oh so poor now, I just couldn't let that proto Major Havoc get away!). Of course I had dreams of it fitting on a small chip in a 40-pin DIP header! Damn reality! ;-) Anyone else interested in buying some of these? Im out of space duel boards. -- Jess M. Askey *** Coming Soon - The Game Archive *** Game Spot/Audio Analyst * Pinball, Video, Parts, Collecting * 509 S. 2nd Street Unit B * http://www.gamearchive.com * Laramie WY 82070 ************************************** From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 17:09:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 17:08:01 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <3FF8121C9B6DD111812100805F31FC0D1CDB54 > From: "David Shoemaker (RhoTech)" To: "'vectorlist > Subject: Off definition request for design help Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 17:07:16 -0800 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: "David Shoemaker (RhoTech)" I am working on a William's multigame rig and in the process of doing the control panel re-routing per game I just don't like my design. As there are many of you here who have very much more EE design knowledge than I, I have been wanting to ask forever. But I refuse to go off the list definition that far. Is there another list with this kind of quality knowledge that anyone here knows about that I could go to instead? Thanks, David PS Yes the Cat Box was also slightly off but what can I say? Update on that soon to follow. From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 17:11:44 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 17:10:22 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 19:09:39 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist Subject: Re: AVG chip schematics In-Reply-To: <34B41762.419A > Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: On Wed, 7 Jan 1998, Jess Askey wrote: > I have them. I made a page at... > > http://www.gamearchive.com/video/manufacturer/atari/vector/tech/avg_controller/ > > Whew, that is a mouthful. :-) > > As it says there, the RAM is only 12 bits at 4 words. Pretty small. > jess Then, it needs 48 latches/registers, which, I think is easily do-able for most PLDs...Not as bad as I thought... It doesn't look bad at all. I'm going to try write some code for this one and see what happens... Joe From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 17:16:27 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 17:15:03 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 17:14:59 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: avg asic Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) is there a small footprint Lattice part that would fit into a 40pin outline? does it use all 40 pins of the package? From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 17:33:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 17:31:49 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <34B42B89.3DE3 > Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 18:27:37 -0700 From: Jess Askey Organization: The Audio Analyst/The Game Spot X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist Subject: Re: avg asic References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Jess Askey Al Kossow wrote: > > is there a small footprint Lattice part that > would fit into a 40pin outline? > > does it use all 40 pins of the package? >From my schems the AVGC uses all 40 pins. -- Jess M. Askey *** Coming Soon - The Game Archive *** Game Spot/Audio Analyst * Pinball, Video, Parts, Collecting * 509 S. 2nd Street Unit B * http://www.gamearchive.com * Laramie WY 82070 ************************************** From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 17:40:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 17:39:07 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) From: zonn (Zonn) To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Off definition request for design help Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 01:40:34 GMT Message-ID: <34b52d5c.22664212 > References: <3FF8121C9B6DD111812100805F31FC0D1CDB54 > In-Reply-To: <3FF8121C9B6DD111812100805F31FC0D1CDB54 > X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: zonn (Zonn) On Wed, 7 Jan 1998 17:07:16 -0800 , "David Shoemaker (RhoTech)" wrote: >I am working on a William's multigame rig and in the process of doing = the >control panel re-routing per game I just don't like my design. As there= are >many of you here who have very much more EE design knowledge than I, I = have >been wanting to ask forever. > >But I refuse to go off the list definition that far. Is there another = list >with this kind of quality knowledge that anyone here knows about that I >could go to instead? > >Thanks, >David > >PS >Yes the Cat Box was also slightly off but what can I say? Update on = that >soon to follow. You just asked the question wrong, try... -------- I am working on a [Cinematronics] multigame rig and in the process of = doing the control panel re-routing per game I just don't like my design. As there = are many of you here who have very much more EE design knowledge than I, I = have been wanting to ask forever. My question is: (blah blah blah) BTW: to make things easier it would be nice if this design would also = work with a Williams multi-game setup... -------- ;-) -Zonn (BTW: I thought the CAT box, being used to fix Atari Vector, games was = right on target) <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ------ ___ Member of A.A.C.S.: |---- | ( ) Association for Artistically / / ( () ) Challenged Signatures / / //\\ // (__) / ---/ // \\ //\\ // zonn -------| // \\/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 17:46:42 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 17:45:18 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 17:46:23 -0800 To: vectorlist From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: AVG chip schematics Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Clay Cowgill >Is there more to it than what is shown in the tempest schem? Did you and >Travis find >some kind of official schem for it? I have a copy of the "real" vector address generator from an anonymous source. He/she asked that I not spread it around. I don't recall if it was a non-disclosure thing or a promise to his/her source or something. If he/she changes his/her mind I'll post it somewhere. (My webpage is "drifting" at the moment.) I guess if I made some boards from the design the "cat would be out of the bag" so to speak anyway... Hmmmmm. Well, I made a promise not to leak it around, so I'll have to wait for clearance. (Problem is that I honestly don't remember who gave it to me. Or rather, I *think* I remember, but I'm not sure. I'm pretty sure he/she will see this message though... ;-) -Clay (On another somewhat unrelated note-- I might make some of the PacMan/MsPacMan "custom chip" replacement boards. The VRAM addresser and Z-80 Sync Bus controller. Those should each fit nicely into a small CPLD. :-) Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 18:00:42 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 17:59:08 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 18:00:20 -0800 To: vectorlist From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: avg asic Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Clay Cowgill >is there a small footprint Lattice part that >would fit into a 40pin outline? I'll have to re-check. They might have an SSOP package for those that MIGHT fit in there. It's entirely possible that I was only looking at the PLCC packages since I *REALLY* didn't want to hand-solder anything smaller. >does it use all 40 pins of the package? Pretty close as I recall. I remember thinking that it might work in a 44pin PLCC part if the macrocell count was high enough. You know... I could do something like: +---------+--------+---------+ | o o o o | | o o o o | | | | | | | | |<-- Not a band-aid. A 40 pin IC sized PCB with | o o o o | | o o o o | a square PLCC in the middle going "over" both +---------+--------+---------+ rows of 40 pin DIP pins... And just clip off the I/O pins that would short out to the through-hole DIP pins. Like: | | | | | | | | | | | --+-------------------+-- + + <-- snipped off pins + + --+ +-- --+ +-- --+ +-- --+ +-- --+ +-- + + + + --+-------------------+-- | | | | | | | | | | | I'd lose some I/O's. (probably 4-8 depending on the package and lead spacing), but at least it would sit "over" the DIP. It's mucho more expensive to make a non-rectangular board like: +---------+ +---------/ \---------+ | | | | | | | | +---------\ /---------+ +---------+ (Have to pay for router time, which is usually only available on a more "production" level pay scale for the PCB's. And the boards are usually too small for the "affordable" manufacturer's to do.) -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 18:06:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 18:04:52 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 18:05:54 -0800 To: vectorlist From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: AVG chip schematics Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Clay Cowgill >> As it says there, the RAM is only 12 bits at 4 words. Pretty small. >> jess > > Then, it needs 48 latches/registers, which, I think is easily >do-able for most PLDs...Not as bad as I thought... > > It doesn't look bad at all. I'm going to try write some code for >this one and see what happens... What kind of PLD's are you looking at? Methinks you'll need a 128 macrocell type critter like the Cypress or Lattice ones... (Or a small colony of 22V10's.) -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Jan 7 21:58:15 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 21:54:58 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <004601bd1bfa$54fbbd40$2a0000df@Obie> From: "David Shoemaker" To: Subject: Re: Off definition request for design help Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 21:57:39 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: "David Shoemaker" >You just asked the question wrong, try... Very good point Zonn :) >I am working on a [Cinematronics] multigame rig and in the process of doing the >control panel re-routing per game I just don't like my design. As there are >many of you here who have very much more EE design knowledge than I, I have >been wanting to ask forever. > >My question is: I am attempting to route say 8 TTL control lines from point a to point b with them being re-arraigned as needed for each game. I want to be able to tie this into a dip switch which picks the "Mode" of the routing. I can do this with a large amount of digital switches but as I can only do one mode in no less than 3 of these parts it is a very cumbersome process as I have say 8 modes to perform. Graphically I am doing something like this (on 4 modes with 4 lines to save space) Mode 1 2 3 4 a a d d b b b c c d c b d c a a Where a-d is the source pin designator and its vertical position in the chart is its destination pin. I know there must be some way to load the "mode" map into some sort of controller which would then route signals to the appropriate place. Ultimate goal would be 16 i/o's with routing. And 8 modes. I am willing to break this up into as many as 4 parts handling 1/4th the load but I am really trying to reduce part count. Cost is not nearly as much an issue but my minimal knowledge of microcontrolers / PLD / GAL / (and the rest of the alphabet soup that goes around here sometimes :) and there capabilities is. One idea I had was using 2 large 8bit EPROM's with the inputs from the control panel being the address select (8 bit + 3 mode select bits) and data outs being the data out to the game. But this really seems like a large waste and I am not sure I can reasonably get EPROM's to perform fast enough for my purpose. Any additional suggestions would be greatly appreciated, >BTW: to make things easier it would be nice if this design would also work with >a Williams multi-game setup... :) Thanks to all. David From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 05:43:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 05:42:08 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Lotus-Fromdomain: SYBASENOTES From: "Paul Tonizzo" To: vectorlist Message-Id: <85256586.004A9E09.00 > Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 08:41:07 -0500 Subject: Re: More Star Trek questions Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: "Paul Tonizzo" >>"Any suggestions on what I should do for a monitor?" > >unfortunately, you don't have any choice. >the G08 is the only vector monitor fast enough Not so! I am running every Sega vector game out of my Space Duel cabinet. It's got a WG color vector in it. There are some very minor vector drawing problems with most of the games. For example, once in a while a stray vector gets drawn in Space Fury. If you want 100% perfection then you should get a G08 - I feel it's excellent on the WG as a whole. FWIW, Star Trek is almost perfect. The only game that is a little messy is TacScan - even then it's quite playable. Paul From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 10:32:54 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 10:31:01 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 12:30:03 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist Subject: Re: AVG chip schematics In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: On Wed, 7 Jan 1998, Clay Cowgill wrote: > What kind of PLD's are you looking at? Methinks you'll need a 128 > macrocell type critter like the Cypress or Lattice ones... (Or a small > colony of 22V10's.) > I'm thinking you're right about it not fitting in a 64 macrocell one (Like a MACH 210) but I'm thinking it will fit into a 96 macrocell one (like a a MACH 220) if not, there's always MACH 230s (128 macrocells.) What I usually do is just write the code, and keep re-targeting it until it fits. Last I remember, AMD MACH stuff was "pretty cheap," and that was 2 or so years ago. Joe From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 10:40:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 10:38:38 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 10:38:26 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Re: AVG chip schematics Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) " Last I remember, AMD MACH stuff was "pretty cheap," and that was 2 or so years ago. " Looking at the small footprint surface mount parts would be helpful to try to get in into a 40 pin outline. For the quantitites we're talking about, I can probably get a rework person around here to put them down on boards for us.. From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 10:47:04 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 10:45:32 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) From: zonn (Zonn) To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Off definition request for design help Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 18:46:48 GMT Message-ID: <34b51a5a.29673997 > References: <004601bd1bfa$54fbbd40$2a0000df@Obie> In-Reply-To: <004601bd1bfa$54fbbd40$2a0000df@Obie> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: zonn (Zonn) On Wed, 7 Jan 1998 21:57:39 -0800, "David Shoemaker" = wrote: >>You just asked the question wrong, try... >Very good point Zonn :) > > > >>I am working on a [Cinematronics] multigame rig and in the process of = doing >the >>control panel re-routing per game I just don't like my design. As = there >are >>many of you here who have very much more EE design knowledge than I, I = have >>been wanting to ask forever. >> >>My question is: > >I am attempting to route say 8 TTL control lines from point a to point b >with them being re-arraigned as needed for each game. I want to be able= to >tie this into a dip switch which picks the "Mode" of the routing. > >I can do this with a large amount of digital switches but as I can only = do >one mode in no less than 3 of these parts it is a very cumbersome = process as >I have say 8 modes to perform. > >Graphically I am doing something like this (on 4 modes with 4 lines to = save >space) > >Mode 1 2 3 4 > a a d d > b b b c > c d c b > d c a a > >Where a-d is the source pin designator and its vertical position in the >chart is its destination pin. > >I know there must be some way to load the "mode" map into some sort of >controller which would then route signals to the appropriate place. > >Ultimate goal would be 16 i/o's with routing. And 8 modes. I am = willing to >break this up into as many as 4 parts handling 1/4th the load but I am >really trying to reduce part count. Cost is not nearly as much an issue= but >my minimal knowledge of microcontrolers / PLD / GAL / (and the rest of = the >alphabet soup that goes around here sometimes :) and there capabilities = is. > >One idea I had was using 2 large 8bit EPROM's with the inputs from the >control panel being the address select (8 bit + 3 mode select bits) and = data >outs being the data out to the game. But this really seems like a large >waste and I am not sure I can reasonably get EPROM's to perform fast = enough >for my purpose. The cleanest would be a self contain microprocessor (like the PIC). You = could get by with just the PIC, a couple of resistors and a cap or two, the = dipswitch, and possibly a voltage regulator. Then whatever connectors you would use= to wire everything up to the control panel. This would of course require software and the ability to burn PICs. PIC = burners can be had fairly cheap. (<$100 I've seen as low as $40 on the net) Large EPROMs would work great and are a magnitude (at the very least) = faster than what you need, don't worry about speed. They only problem you might= have with EPROMs is glitches as they change states. It is possible for data = lines to glitch as the address decoder of the EPROM ripples through it's logic = looking for the right data. I doubt it will be a problem (the glitches, if = present, are *very* fast). Any glitch that might show up will most likely be ignored = by the debounce logic of the game. You could synchronously clock the data = through the EPROMs but this would take a bit of external logic. All in all the EPROMs would be your simplest solution if you have an = EPROM programmer. -Zonn <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ------ ___ Member of A.A.C.S.: |---- | ( ) Association for Artistically / / ( () ) Challenged Signatures / / //\\ // (__) / ---/ // \\ //\\ // zonn -------| // \\/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 11:16:51 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 11:14:42 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 13:13:58 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist Subject: CAT Box Project Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Hey all, I took a look at the schematics for the CAT box, and the most feasable solution to me seems like a 4-chip solution for the logic PCB: 1 6502 1 6532 1 ROM 1 PLD for all the rest (maybe 2) I'm wondering just how available the 6502 and 6532s are. I know of a cheap source for 6532s (Well, he had plenty of them a couple of months ago...) but my source for cheap 6502s dried up. I'm not worried about the ROM or PLD. Joe From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 11:19:43 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 11:18:20 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 11:18:16 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Re: CAT Box Project Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) I need a bunch of 6532's right now to fix some QBert sound boards. Could you post the source? From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 11:45:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 11:43:14 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 11:44:22 -0800 To: vectorlist From: Clay Cowgill Subject: AVG ASIC... Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Clay Cowgill I printed out my AVG ASIC replacement design file and brought it with me. :-) So... What's different... Open up Jess' avg_controller/schematic.gif from the address posted yesterdat and follow along. Basically the only real change is the width of the address bus. Instead of everything being 12 bits wide it's 14. Looking at the clock input to the stack pointer (K4 in the schematic on Jess' page) the ls08, ls32, and '74 are not included in the actual ASIC. (So the input to CK is just "/strobe1".) The DMAPUSH and DMALD (push and pop) are handled a bit differently opcode information is brought in from the state machine with strobe signals and are used to internally generate /GW and /GR for the '670s. Increment for the counter array is generated internally too. The buffers are more like ls244's since you have 14 bit wide data instead of the 12 bits that fir nicely on two '367s. Soooooo... One macrocell for each bit of stack: 14 * 4 = 56 One macrocell for each bit of vram address generator: 14 * 1 = 14 One macrocell for each bit of stack pointer: 2 * 1 = 2 Buffers should be free with each macrocell. Might need one or two more for the combinational stuff, but I think it'd probably fit in each macrocell above... So the total is around 72-74 macrocells. Distressingly close to the cheaper 64 macrocell devices (missed if by *that* much... *sigh* :-) but an easy fit into a 128 m-cell CPLD. Hmmmmmm... I already have the Lattice CPLD stuff set up (with in-circuit programming) and a 68pin plcc-> DIP convertor board to do my little vector-generator project. I'll take a look at it tonight. I wonder if there are any 128 macrocell 44pin SSOP CPLD's out there? -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 11:57:38 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 11:56:00 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 11:32:07 -0800 From: John Robertson <"pinball@istar.ca"@istar.ca> Organization: John's Jukes Ltd X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03Gold (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Simple XY B&W system References: <34B3409D.CC5A9452@istar.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: John Robertson <"pinball@istar.ca"@istar.ca> John Robertson wrote: > > Yeah, opps, my ftp program crashed, so it might be a day or two untill I > find where the problem is. I really hate DOS/WINDOWS!!! > John :-#(# > > Al Kossow wrote: > > > > XXXX://www.flippers.com/hoei-xy.jpg wasn't found (wrong address!!) > It's uploading right now...will VERIFY that it is there, so if you see this meesage, go get it! -->> http://www.flippers.com/jpeg/hoei-xy.jpg John :-#)# -- John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) mailto:jrr "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out." From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 11:58:36 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 11:57:13 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 11:40:23 -0800 From: John Robertson <"pinball@istar.ca"@istar.ca> Organization: John's Jukes Ltd X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03Gold (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist Subject: Re: WTB:SPO-250 IC References: <34B39EA6.20EC@netconx.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: John Robertson <"pinball@istar.ca"@istar.ca> Hmm should have a few of these lying around...what are they worth to folks? perhaps an auction? John :-#?# Todd Miller wrote: > > I thought I'd ask since a mint Zektor surfaced, does anyone have a > extra SPO-250 Orator chip to sell ? The one in the Star Trek set > I just picked up is dead. > -- > Thanks > > Todd > > http://www.netconx.net/~litterbox -- John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) mailto:jrr "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out." From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 12:16:25 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 12:14:59 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Subject: Re: CAT Box Project To: vectorlist Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:12:40 -0700 (MST) From: "Kurt Mahan" In-Reply-To: from "jwelser " at Jan 8, 98 01:13:58 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Message-ID: <34b541480.73e5 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 334 Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: "Kurt Mahan" > I'm wondering just how available the 6502 and 6532s are. I know > of a cheap source for 6532s (Well, he had plenty of them a couple of > months ago...) but my source for cheap 6502s dried up. I'm not worried > about the ROM or PLD. BG Micro has the 6502s at a "reasonable" price -- dunno about 6532s.. Probably though.. Kurt From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 13:00:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 12:57:56 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: From: "Ozdemir, Steve" To: "'vectorlist > Subject: Audio Reg II board smoking? Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 12:58:10 -0800 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: "Ozdemir, Steve" G'day folks (and Ray), As I converted my Asteroids caberet to play Asteroids Deluxe last night, I swapped the Audio Reg 1 board for an Audio Reg II from a Tempest. That went OK. I heard Asteroids Deluxe's sounds perfectly and happily played it. However, when I swapped back in the Asteroids board, R30, on the Audio Reg II started smoking! (Retesting with the Asteroids Deluxe board and the smoked Audio Reg II showed that there was no damage.) Unfortunately, I didn't have any schematics to Asteroids Deluxe or Tempest available at the time. Any guesses why I'd see this behavior? By the way before I ever put the Audio Reg II board into the cabinet, I did try the Asteroids Deluxe with the Audio Reg 1, and the sound was funny as expected. Also after the resistor smoked and just before I quit, I did retest the Asteroids board to make sure it was OK. It survived. Steven S Ozdemir sso ps - Something else might be wrong, since R6 (or R1) on the Audio Reg 1 board is also smoked. Both Asteroids and Asteroids Deluxe's audio and video work? From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 13:21:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 13:19:53 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 16:19:02 -0500 (EST) From: Duncan Brown Subject: Re: Audio Reg II board smoking? To: vectorlist Message-id: <01IS527Z3MRS00VZTH@Eisner.DECUS.Org> Organization: Digital Equipment Computer Users Society X-VMS-To: IN%"vectorlist " X-VMS-Cc: BROWN_DU MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Duncan Brown Steve, > However, when I swapped back in the Asteroids board, R30, on the Audio > Reg II started smoking! (Retesting with the Asteroids Deluxe board and > the smoked Audio Reg II showed that there was no damage.) > Unfortunately, I didn't have any schematics to Asteroids Deluxe or > Tempest available at the time. Any guesses why I'd see this behavior? I don't have my schematics memorized yet, but I'm going to take a stab at this as being the infamous "sense resistor problem." Atari overdesigned their supplies and included a feedback loop on +5V (+sense) and ground (-sense), to account for any voltage drop in the wiring harness. Niice idea, but if you look at the circuit and then imagine the normal 5V and ground connections being interrupted for some reason (like, say, the ever-fail Atari board edge connectors), you'll notice that the power and ground can still get to the logic board, and very much want to...but they have to pass through a 1/4W resistor to do it...and they do, with the predictable result. Once you reseat the board and get the supply connections going good again, everything works fine, but now you have an open in the sense circuit because the resistor is fried. Fix your edge connectors, replace the resistors, and you're good for another couple of dozen board remove/insert operations. Duncan From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 14:13:05 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:11:09 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <34B54E96.2365 > Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 17:09:26 -0500 From: Joel Rosenzweig Organization: Hewlett-Packard Medical Products Group X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (WinNT; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist Subject: Defender RAMs References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Joel Rosenzweig Hi Clay, A while back, you had a web page that described how to hook up 4164 RAM to Williams games. Do you still have this page up somewhere? I need to install these chips into my Defender, and I didn't have the pinouts of either chip handy, so I thought your how-to guide would be a great resource. And now, of course, when I went to look for it, I couldn't find it anymore. :-( If it's not up anywhere, could you email me the information, if you still have it around? BTW, a while back, I bought a NOS WG HV transformer from Gaymond. I haven't had occasion to use it yet. I thought I was going to need it, before I learned much about WG HV units (i.e. they almost never fail). At any rate, I remember you saying that there are WG look alike HV transformers for this monitor that played a cruel joke on you, because they look the same, or similar, but were not in fact the real McCoy so to speak. How would you tell the difference between the real part, and the incorrect one? I want to make sure that mine is a valid replacement. Thanks for any info! Joel- From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 14:22:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:20:38 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <34B550D1.1F9C > Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 17:18:57 -0500 From: Joel Rosenzweig Organization: Hewlett-Packard Medical Products Group X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (WinNT; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Defender RAMs References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Joel Rosenzweig Joel Rosenzweig wrote: > > Hi Clay, ... Sorry guys. I guess you figured out that I cut n pasted the wrong address into my mailer. Sorry. Joel- From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 14:29:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:25:04 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:25:00 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Defender RAMs Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) I was wondering why clay has been so quiet... Turns out his mail adr changed from "clay" to "clayc" so the mailing list has been bouncing all his mail messages.. From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 14:48:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:46:04 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Comments: ( Received on motgate.mot.com from client pobox.mot.com, sender jenison ) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 16:45:11 -0600 (CST) From: Mark Jenison Message-Id: <9801081645.ZM6964@calcite> In-Reply-To: aek (Al Kossow) "Re: Defender RAMs" (Jan 8, 2:25pm) References: <199801082232.RAA16550 > X-face: "@9[FFAftX<9}2=gaPlIyRv_K%h[>.@"8t}B2So!iv.\#M9NplA9bDudBQ|]E`WL9Kd,Tn2v.0OGcE<$yg{&}(m:mB\GO9L+yE}6=d17BM X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.1 10apr95) To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Defender RAMs Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Mark Jenison On Jan 8, 2:25pm, Al Kossow wrote: > Subject: Re: Defender RAMs > I was wondering why clay has been so quiet... > Turns out his mail adr changed from "clay" to "clayc" so > the mailing list has been bouncing all his mail messages.. >-- End of excerpt from Al Kossow I also got this trying to access his web page: http://www.wwwpro.com/clay/ File Not Found The requested URL /clay/ was not found on this server. ?? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Mark Jenison E-mail address: jenison Cellular Infrastructure Group Motorola--Arlington Heights, IL ---------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Mark Jenison From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 14:49:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:47:25 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <199801081454570300.0026CE1D > X-Mailer: Calypso Version 2.30.23 Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 14:54:57 -0800 From: "Warren 'Llama' Ernst" To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Audio Reg II board smoking? Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: "Warren 'Llama' Ernst" On 1/8/98, at 4:19 PM, Duncan Brown wrote: >Steve, > >> However, when I swapped back in the Asteroids board, R30, on the Audio >> Reg II started smoking! (Retesting with the Asteroids Deluxe board and >> the smoked Audio Reg II showed that there was no damage.) >> Unfortunately, I didn't have any schematics to Asteroids Deluxe or >> Tempest available at the time. Any guesses why I'd see this behavior? > > I don't have my schematics memorized yet, but I'm going to take > a stab at this as being the infamous "sense resistor problem." > > Atari overdesigned their supplies and included a feedback loop on > +5V (+sense) and ground (-sense), to account for any voltage drop > in the wiring harness. Niice idea, but if you look at the circuit > and then imagine the normal 5V and ground connections being > interrupted for some reason (like, say, the ever-fail Atari board > edge connectors), you'll notice that the power and ground can > still get to the logic board, and very much want to...but they > have to pass through a 1/4W resistor to do it...and they do, with > the predictable result. > > Once you reseat the board and get the supply connections going > good again, everything works fine, but now you have an open in the > sense circuit because the resistor is fried. > > Fix your edge connectors, replace the resistors, and you're good > for another couple of dozen board remove/insert operations. > Ah, this would explain why I have a pole position cockpit with two AudioII/Reg boards with friend resistors, yet the game continues to work fine. -Warr ------------------------------+---------------------------------------- Reviewer, "Windows Magazine" | Warren Ernst - warren Author, "Using Netscape" | http://www.cris.com/~wernst/ "Internet 1997 Unleashed" (c) | Computer Journalist, Consultant, Author "Netscape 3 Unleashed"(contr) | Graphic Artist, Nerd "Presenting ActiveX" | Que and Sams.Net Publishing | "If it ain't broke, don't break it." ------------------------------+---------------------------------------- From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 15:06:25 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:04:45 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:56:51 -0700 (MST) From: Anders Knudsen X-Sender: andersk@janeway To: vectorlist cc: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: AVG ASIC... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Anders Knudsen On Thu, 8 Jan 1998, Clay Cowgill wrote: > > So the total is around 72-74 macrocells. Distressingly close to the > cheaper 64 macrocell devices (missed if by *that* much... *sigh* :-) but an > easy fit into a 128 m-cell CPLD. > > Hmmmmmm... I already have the Lattice CPLD stuff set up (with in-circuit > programming) and a 68pin plcc-> DIP convertor board to do my little > vector-generator project. I'll take a look at it tonight. I wonder if > there are any 128 macrocell 44pin SSOP CPLD's out there? > I thought that they also made 96 macrocell 44pin also.?.? At least I know Altera has them. -anders. +------------------------------------------+ | Anders Knudsen | ASIC Design Engineer | Adaptec, Inc., Boulder Technology Center +------------------------------------------+ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 15:06:31 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:04:33 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <199801082156.PAA01448@fermat.mayo.edu> Content-Type: text/plain Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 4.1mach v148) In-Reply-To: X-Nextstep-Mailer: Mail 4.1mach (Enhance 2.0b5) From: Ray Ghanbari Date: Thu, 8 Jan 98 15:57:24 -0600 To: vectorlist Subject: Re: Audio Reg II board smoking? References: Organization: Mayo Foundation Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Ray Ghanbari You wrote: > G'day folks (and Ray), Not sure how I'm supposed to take this ;-) > However, when I swapped back in the Asteroids board, R30, on the Audio > Reg II started smoking! (Retesting with the Asteroids Deluxe board and > the smoked Audio Reg II showed that there was no damage.) > Unfortunately, I didn't have any schematics to Asteroids Deluxe or > Tempest available at the time. Any guesses why I'd see this behavior? Like Duncan, I don't have the schematics memorized, however, everytime I've seen resistors on A/R boards glow, it was because of a crappy connection at the edge connector. Like Duncan said, the board goes nuts trying to drive 5V and blows itself out. Make sure you have good connections at the A/R board, the pins of the edge connector (they tend to fry on Atari games), and the edge connector of the PCB is clean. Ideally, all your Atari vector games should have the 5V and +sense lines on the wiring harness shorted to one another (I learned this lesson from Rick Schieve). That way, if you have bad contact at the sense or 5V contact, you don't fry your A/R board or game PCB as the game tries to compensate. Instead, the game doesn't work or goes flakey. That is a good sign that you need to clean the contacts on the connector. Hope this helps Ray From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 15:09:05 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:07:36 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:08:53 -0800 To: vectorlist From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: Defender RAMs Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Clay Cowgill >I was wondering why clay has been so quiet... >Turns out his mail adr changed from "clay" to "clayc" so >the mailing list has been bouncing all his mail messages.. Now that I think about that, that's weird. At least some of my messages have been getting through somehow since Jess, Joe, Kev, and couple others have been responding. Did the AVG replacement discussions today make it out? -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 15:15:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:13:45 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:14:24 -0800 To: vectorlist From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: Defender RAMs Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Clay Cowgill >I also got this trying to access his web page: > >http://www.wwwpro.com/clay/ > >File Not Found >The requested URL /clay/ was not found on this server. > >?? Yep, brief info there... My ISP is a college buddy that just sold his company (the one that runs wwwpro.com), so my website is moving to his *new* company. It should be back in a couple days, probably at "e-volve.net". I'll post when I find it's final resting place. ;-) -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 15:49:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:47:56 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:49:19 -0800 To: vectorlist From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: Defender RAMs Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Clay Cowgill >A while back, you had a web page that described how to hook up 4164 RAM >to Williams games. Do you still have this page up somewhere? I need to >install these chips into my Defender, and I didn't have the pinouts of >either chip handy, so I thought your how-to guide would be a great >resource. And now, of course, when I went to look for it, I couldn't >find it anymore. :-( My webpage *should* be back tomorrow at a new address. In the mean-time I think the modification was something like: Bend out pin 1 so it won't go in the socket (or snip it off) Bend out pin 8 so it won't go in the socket (or snip it off, but leave a tab) Solder a little wire from pin 9 to pin 8. You can also do it 256kx1 DRAMs, but I think you need to pull pin 1 high or low. >BTW, a while back, I bought a NOS WG HV transformer from Gaymond. I >haven't had occasion to use it yet. I thought I was going to need it, >before I learned much about WG HV units (i.e. they almost never fail). >At any rate, I remember you saying that there are WG look alike HV >transformers for this monitor that played a cruel joke on you, because >they look the same, or similar, but were not in fact the real McCoy so >to speak. How would you tell the difference between the real part, and >the incorrect one? I want to make sure that mine is a valid >replacement. There will be a part-number sticker on the HV transformer. The "fake" ones carry a different number. Otherwise the only way to tell is to ohm out the pins on the bottom. That info is also on my webpage-- in the "test a WG transformer" page. -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 17:01:22 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 16:59:23 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 16:59:16 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: John's deflection schematic Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) is up on spies now http://www.spies.com/arcade/schematics/hoei-xy.jpg From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 17:09:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 17:07:24 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <3FF8121C9B6DD111812100805F31FC0D1CDB5C > From: "David Shoemaker (RhoTech)" To: "'vectorlist > Subject: CAT Box Project (interest gauge) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 17:06:16 -0800 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: "David Shoemaker (RhoTech)" After talking to a couple of people now who are helping me move forward I need to start doing some research on interest. Assume a "Work alike" solution which might not be quite as self contained as the original. Please tell me how many of what from the following you would be interested in. I am not looking for orders but more a rough gauging of interest. Bag o Parts kit This would be: production circuit board(s) Keypad Displays Power supply Interface cables Full parts bag programmed as needed A copy of the original docs. NOT including an enclosure / case ____ @$50 ____ @$100 ____ @$150 ____ @$200 Then I would like to know how important the following are (assuming I told you part #'s and locations to purchase on your own). Reducing the number of things I include in the kit will of course reduce the cost. Power supply included Displays included Keypad included Interface cables Finally I can see two modes for this thing: Original tool case type transportation for field work Bench top type arrangement. Which would you like better? It will probably require some modification for the two different modes (displays, keypads, interfacing, etc.) I prefer bench top myself but want opinions. Basically I am trying to figure out how much of what I need to purchase and what parts to get maximum interest on the things. Plus what the price range of real interest is. At this moment I have done NO pricing of any parts yet. So I am coming up with the above prices out of either. It might be possible for a true "Bare bones" kit to come in at $25. Or a full kit to run $300+. I don't know but I don't want to take up a lot of valuable time for the people involved if it is not going to work out. More details as they come up. David From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 17:13:38 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 17:12:04 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 17:11:59 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Re: CAT Box Project (interest gauge) Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: aek (Al Kossow) If you were going to do this, wouldn't it make sense to add a PC parallel port to the thing and get rid of the display altogether? Or, you could squish the whole thing down to fit on an ISA card with a 40 pin cable coming off of it... From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 17:24:47 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 17:23:23 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 17:24:32 -0800 To: vectorlist From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Clay's webpage Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: Clay Cowgill ...is up and well again. http://www.e-volve.net/~clay Let me know if anything is broken. I just ftp'd the site over and it *seems* ok. Oh, Joel-- the part number for the "right" WG flyback (as it appears on the part) is on there too... -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 20:33:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:31:29 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Subject: Re: CAT Box Project (interest gauge) To: vectorlist Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 22:30:59 -0700 (MST) From: "Kurt Mahan" In-Reply-To: from "Al Kossow" at Jan 8, 98 05:11:59 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Message-ID: <34b5b6130.f87 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 377 Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: "Kurt Mahan" > If you were going to do this, wouldn't it make sense to > add a PC parallel port to the thing and get rid of the > display altogether? Or, you could squish the whole thing > down to fit on an ISA card with a 40 pin cable coming > off of it... This would be cool. It would also be nice to drive a lot of it from the pc itself. (I can help with software if needed..) Kurt From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 20:37:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:35:46 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 12:05:24 -0800 From: John Robertson <"pinball@istar.ca"@istar.ca> Organization: John's Jukes Ltd X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03Gold (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist Subject: Re: More Star Trek questions References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: John Robertson <"pinball@istar.ca"@istar.ca> Al Kossow wrote: > > "Any suggestions on what I should do for a monitor?" > > unfortunately, you don't have any choice. > the G08 is the only vector monitor fast enough If enough people nag me I will get the four or so GO8's that I have running... Now, the question is, what are they worth to folks? I ask this because if they are worth only $100US I really have more important things to do with my time, however if folks offer, say, $300+US then I would be happy to restore them. $200US and I might consider it, but not likely any rush. I suspect I shall have to get at least one running and put it up for auction to see what happens...the problem with doing this as a business is I have nasty bills (you know, rent, phone, hydro, advertising, etc.) to pay and only a limited amount of work time to make the money to pay them...sometimes I think I should get a real job and make this the hobby... John :-#)# -- John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) mailto:jrr "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out." From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 20:38:43 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:37:15 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 20:06:20 -0800 From: John Robertson <"pinball@istar.ca"@istar.ca> Organization: John's Jukes Ltd X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03Gold (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist Subject: Re: CAT Box Project (interest gauge) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: Sender: owner-vectorlist Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist CC: John Robertson <"pinball@istar.ca"@istar.ca> Al Kossow wrote: > > If you were going to do this, wouldn't it make sense to > add a PC parallel port to the thing and get rid of the > display altogether? Or, you could squish the whole thing > down to fit on an ISA card with a 40 pin cable coming > off of it... Howdy! Some folks don't use IBM compatables (they have more free time as a result). Why not make it a RS-232 then more folks have a chance... John :-#)# -- John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) mailto:jrr "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out." From spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Jan 8 20:41:41 1998 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:40:14 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: